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Effect Veiler vs Sangan


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#1
CenterFielder

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Does Sangan resolve when it goes to the grave?

What about other monsters that have the same "when this card goes to the grave from the field" effects?


Please explain why as well. I know I'm just a beginner but I'm really trying hard to learn.
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#2
Kraziub

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sangan resolves and searches a monster since Sangan left the field veiler can no longer negate it.
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Oh yeah same thing for all the other field to grave cards
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#3
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Sangan resolves in graveyard. Veiler negates Sangan's effect as long as Sangan face-up on field due to Veiler's text

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#4
GxMaster

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Sangan resolves in graveyard. Veiler negates Sangan's effect as long as Sangan face-up on field due to Veiler's text


During your opponent's Main Phase: You can send this card from your hand to the Graveyard to target 1 face-up Effect monster your opponent controls; negate that target's effects until the End Phase.

... You Sure <~<?

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#5
CenterFielder

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Sangan resolves in graveyard. Veiler negates Sangan's effect as long as Sangan face-up on field due to Veiler's text


During your opponent's Main Phase: You can send this card from your hand to the Graveyard to target 1 face-up Effect monster your opponent controls; negate that target's effects until the End Phase.

... You Sure <~<?


this was my line of thinking.
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#6
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Veiler only negates effects on field not ones that resolve in the grave.

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#7
RareHunter

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Sangan resolves in graveyard. Veiler negates Sangan's effect as long as Sangan face-up on field due to Veiler's text


During your opponent's Main Phase: You can send this card from your hand to the Graveyard to target 1 face-up Effect monster your opponent controls; negate that target's effects until the End Phase.

... You Sure <~<?

Read da Bold text
since cards in your graveyard not count as card you control, Veiler's effect gone and Sangan can search.

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#8
aiwotorimodose

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@OP:
what you need to learn is, where was that monster effect activated. Veiler will only negates an effect that activated on the field.
meanwhile sangan activated in the grave, so veiler will do nothing to sangan effect.

ps: effect always activated and resolved on the same place, the card doesn't drag the effect with it.

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#9
RareHunter

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ps: effect always activated and resolved on the same place, the card doesn't drag the effect with it.

Your comment isnt valid, son. How u explain Stardust Dragon, Thunder King Rai-Oh, etc?

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#10
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Just to clear up a bit of confusion, Effect Veiler negates effects that activate on the field, even if the monster is off the field at resolution. Examples of monsters with said effects are Exiled Force, Thunder King Rai-Oh, Mystic Piper, and Rescue Rabbit. Effect Veiler does not negate effects that activate in the grave, such as Mystic Tomato, Sangan, or Tour Bus of the Underworld.
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#11
nero77

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Veiler can't negate the effect of Sangan unless Sangan is face-up on the field.

#12
morfowt

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ps: effect always activated and resolved on the same place, the card doesn't drag the effect with it.

Your comment isnt valid, son. How u explain Stardust Dragon, Thunder King Rai-Oh, etc?

both effects activate and resolve on field. it's only the card itself that is not on the field which is why skill drain doesn't negate them.

#13
aiwotorimodose

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ps: effect always activated and resolved on the same place, the card doesn't drag the effect with it.

Your comment isnt valid, son. How u explain Stardust Dragon, Thunder King Rai-Oh, etc?

hello son, I've been making the same mistake as you does like about 3 years ago, thinking that the monster dragged the effect with it for the skill drain explanation, which of course isn't true. the correct reasoning is; as morfowt explaned above, skill drain only cares whether the monster (that activate it's effect on the field) still face-up on the field upon resolution.

It's never matter wherever the monster is at the point of effect resolution effect always, effect always activated and resolved on the same place (wherever it got activated in the first place).

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#14
k1ll @t w!ll

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Skill Drain can't negate Stardust/Thunder King Rai-Oh/ Exiled Force because they're not face-up on the field when their effect resolves.

Veiler negates them because it cares where the effect resolves. If you Veiler a face-up Stardust then you negate it's effect.

Effect activate and resolves at the same place (grave/hand/field..)

Both can't negate Sangan because it activates/resolves in the grave.

#15
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ps: effect always activated and resolved on the same place, the card doesn't drag the effect with it.

Your comment isnt valid, son. How u explain Stardust Dragon, Thunder King Rai-Oh, etc?


Why should there be an explanation? Stardust Dragon and Thunder King Rai-Oh effects both activate on field and resolve on field.

Sangan will trigger in Graveyard and will not be negated by Veiler.


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#16
storyteller

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Never get Skill Drain and Effect Veiler mixed up. They are two totally different classes of effects.

Skill Drain, DHero Plasma, and Fiendish Chain are similar in that they stop affecting a monster once the monster leaves the field.
So long as the monster whose effect is activating is face-down or no longer on the field, then it won't negate.

Effect Veiler and Forbidden Chalice, on the other hand, cares only that the effect is applied or activates on the field. When talking about where the activation is, consider where the monster is before the cost is paid. If a monster tributes itself as cost, it is on the field before the cost is paid; the effect activates on the field. If a card says when removed from the field, when sent to grave, etc. It obviously activates in the Grave, or wherever it's sent to.

This is really only confusing in the TCG due to ignition-on-summon priority. Because we can activate ignition effects on priority, a lot of tribute-as-cost effects are activated on priority, which means that they are off the field before the opponent can respond, so veiler can't touch them. Some of us learn this incorrectly, thinking that those effects in general just can't be touched by veiler. This just isn't true. If the effects aren't or can't be activated on priority at summon, veiler works perfectly fine. For example, a veiler'd Stardust can tribute itself to attempt to negate a destruction effect later in the turn, but will resolve without effect since veiler is negating it.
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#17
sagax06

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Sangan resolves in grave and bybassses cards like skill drain, fiendish chain and vieler.
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